Okay so what class should i be looking into?

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geowit
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Post by geowit »

dspgti wrote:How about this idea? All turbo/huffer cars would be put in Street Mod except those cars that would qualify for Showroom Stock like the Mini Cooper S.

Dave Y.
FYI - 02-06 MINI Cooper S = supercharged

07-newer MINI Cooper S = tubocharged

Pretty easy to spot mods to super, not so easy on turbo as it is h/w vs s/w.
Thanks,
Geo.
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Post by dspgti »

I used the Mini because I "think" it is the only classified SS car that is forced induction. (Does anyone realize there is no SSA yet we continue to run a class? And for the most part SS is for up to 10 year old cars.) As of 2008 GCR only the blown Mini up to 2006 is in SSB. 2007 turbo is in T3. There's another can of worms. Now we will get T1, T2,T3 cars showing up forming new classes. These classes cover the forced induction, Mustang Cobra's, WRX's, STI, EVO's etc.

Anyway, Touring and Showroom Stock are very specific on non modifications and they are road racing classes that have taken into consideration performance potential.

Sorry to keep rehashing what has been said before but I believe Mike Ancas' original posting under the Propsed Rule Forum has been missed or ignored. Please reread his postings. It makes a lot of sense.

And Let's get some support for trimming down the number of classes.

Dave Y
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Post by jerdeitzel »

Well the WRX actually goes into ESP. Plus that wasn't a good example because he runs steet tires.

Now i will fully agree with Mike Ancas as to the problem with the unlimited boost that you can run in SP classes. I ran this year with cams in the car which put me into SM. Now my car could be set up alittle different to make the same power without the cams. Then i could run BSP. That really would make it pretty darn hard for Any car in any SP class to keep up on a hill. Now don't get me wrong there are a few ASP cars out there that would be a good fight but not much in BSP. I think its not a bad idea for the turbo cars to either be bumped to ASP for the hills or SM. Now really this is not about "all" turbo cars tho. There really arn't many stock turbo cars that fall into the SP classes that it makes that much difference as to the boost limit as the EVO and STI do. These cars are at an advantage on a hill way more then any other.
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Post by brandonl »

There are far too many classes and I think that a much more basic classing system is need. FWD, RWD and AWD separated into stock, modified or unlimited is simple to police and is being used by the redline time attack series with great success. Of course this would be for any cars that are not fully fitting into a current and recognized SCCA racing class, not solo class with a small turn out. This would a great catch-all for any class that has less than lets say, 5 competitors.

Take a look below for redline's rules which could be used for classing cars but the SCCA GCR's would stick around for safety equipment etc if need be.

http://www.redlinetimeattack.com/docs/2 ... ulesV2.pdf

Any thoughts?
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okay so what class should I be looking into

Post by Joe Foering »

Unfortunately, SCCA-in both the GCR & TTR- states in TTR 10.1: "All classes listed in the current GCR (both National and Regional) must be accomodated. This rule is to allow a place to compete for any car prepared to a GCR class but does not restrict classes from being consolidated because of limited participation."
I would think that rule means that we must provide for all GCR/TTR classes but does not prohibit consolidating some low-entry classes for trophies.
Further, it appears that the TTR rule on seats now reads "it is stongly recommended" no longer "shall be replaced" with reference to the driver's seat.
Nothing new yet on the homologation rule.
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Post by dspgti »

I think we hyjacked AStaidle's thread. Hope we are giving you an answer.

First, I thought the Ralley Sooby was an STI. Can't remember now. I was lumping that with the EVO's which both are BSP.

As Joe states, we must accomodate for all GCR (club racing) classified cars. I think we can interpit that to mean that since we have a Specials class already, we are free to exclude SPU/O? ( I can't find SPU/O in the 2008 GCR. Can someone tell me where it is?) That takes care of the GCR classes.

Now! If we could just make up our minds on the SOLO II classes. We talked about this at our BMR meeting last night and I'm not sure of the answer. Do the TT rules say "accomodate" all SOLO II classified cars as well??? If so that can't apply to Level 4 hillclimb can it? So, we are free to restrict SOLO II classes to SP and SM.

Does anyone want to present good reasons why not to restrict Street Prepared classes to no "Forced Induction"? All forced induction entries that are not classified in the GCR will be put in Street Mod.

Then, we can get on with class reduction and bumping order, right?

Send your cards, letters, and comments. I think this issue will be put to a vote at the February PHA meeting. I think the vote technically passed at the November meeting but was shelved for further comments.

Nothing better to do than stir the pot,
Dave Y.
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Post by brandonl »

Well you can recognize all the racing classes but if there arent enough entries to make a competitive field is there any reason (or a formal rule) they couldnt get lumped in a larger mor general class?

On the forced induction/factory beast topic, what AWD cars these days are not FI anyway? Of the 2wd forced induction cars (which there arent many) which arent already in street mod or a special class already?
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Post by RX-Midget »

dspgti wrote:...I think we can interpit that to mean that since we have a Specials class already, we are free to exclude SPU/O? ( I can't find SPU/O in the 2008 GCR. Can someone tell me where it is?)...
SPO/U is only a regional class, not a national class listed in the GCR. PHA's Specials classes cover that segement pretty well already.

Merry Christmas

B.
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Post by RX-Midget »

geowit wrote:
dspgti wrote:
Pretty easy to spot mods to super, not so easy on turbo as it is h/w vs s/w.
You can overdrive a supercharger with just a small pulley diameter change (small enough that you would not notice with just eye-ball'n it). You would have to measure both the crank and s/c pulley to verify it has the stock ratio.

I just did this on a supercharger I installed on a Lotus Elise. Big change from 8psi to 10psi with only a 0.1" diameter change and it is in a hard to access area to measure.
Joe Foering
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okay so what class should I be looking into

Post by Joe Foering »

Let's use the word CONSOLIDATION not reduction of classes... Again, while we must accomodate ALL GCR/TTR classes, we can CONSOLIDATE the smaller classes for trophy purposes.
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Post by dspgti »

You always have a better way with words Joe.

Dave Y
Joe Foering
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okay so what class should I be looking in

Post by Joe Foering »

I suggest using the word "consolidation" only because it is the same word that is used in the TTR...
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