Where to find the supps for 2014

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gdh57
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Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

I asked this question on another thread, but I guess it got buried.

Where can I find the supps we will be running under for 2014. I had someone who is new ask me. They are not online at SCCA.com, and they do not appear to be on PHA's website anyway. Anyone who is preparing a new car for this season will need to have copy of the rules now rather than wait for the first entry form to be made available.

Thanks

Grace
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Mazdahead »

The supplemental rules are always added to the registration documentation and are supposed to be specific to each event.
If the folks responsible for producing the supplementals could send them to me I could post them where the registration form is usually available. (Schedule and Events)
If there is going to be one supplemental rules sheet that is going to be duplicated from event to event then I could post a common link just for the supplementals.
Since we agreed to use march 2013 Time Trial Rules most of what they need should be in them and they are posted on the rules page and the classes page on our website.
http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/rules/ or http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/classes/
I think we have always had this problem with supplemental rules. You don't know if anything has changed until a few weeks before an event because of the timing when I receive them to post onto the web site. I have inquired in the past about this and it seemed like too big a stone for me to move since they are generated by the region hosting the event. Maybe we could discuss this at the next meeting? I think it would be fantastic if it were posted on the site until it is modified for some reason. I could also leave the link on the schedule and results page from the previous year for registration, instead of removing the link, so the old supps are at least able to be downloaded? Any other ideas?
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Matt Rowe »

This year is a much different situation as we will be using a PHA specific set of rules that covers all of the SCCA minimum requirements as well as the previous rules AND the typical items out of the event form supps. This means the entry form supps can be shorter and will typically be focused on event specific operational items like pit procedures as opposed to preparation items like PHA specific classes.

Dave Merritt has been taking the lead in coordinating the assembly of the new document including gaining approval from SCCA national. He has initial approval but was looking for a clarification on a couple of items before considering it final. As soon as that is complete we had agreed to provide a copy to our friendly webmaster for prominent inclusion on the website.
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by TKnorr »

If you follow the March, 2013 Time Trial Rules in preparing a race car to meet the safety standards for 2014, everything will be fine. These rules can be found on this website.
Tom Knorr, PHA President
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

I'm unable to find the link to the March 2013 rules on the PHA website. Can you tell me where it is located?

Thanks!

Grace
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Wizco »

Took me a while too, but they are here: http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/rules/

Pa Hill Climb>Drivers>Rules
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Mazdahead »

The supplemental rules are always added to the registration documentation and are supposed to be specific to each event.
If the folks responsible for producing the supplementals could send them to me I could post them where the registration form is usually available. (Schedule and Events)
If there is going to be one supplemental rules sheet that is going to be duplicated from event to event then I could post a common link just for the supplementals.
Since we agreed to use march 2013 Time Trial Rules most of what they need should be in them and they are posted on the rules page and the classes page on our website.
http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/rules/ or http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/classes/

Reposted from above
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Rich Rock »

For the past several years, we have been operating all PHA events with a standardized set of supps. The same supps apply to every event. The event supps are the PHA supps.

There is a "supplementary regulations" section on this forum, been there for years. If you check it you will see that in 2011 and 2012, I posted messages with links to the PHA supps. It seems I forgot to do that in 2013, but the supps were posted on the BMR site, and they will be there when the 2014 supps are published, which will be soon.
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

Wizco wrote:Took me a while too, but they are here: http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/rules/

Pa Hill Climb>Drivers>Rules
Dan, you are awesome, this is exactly what I was looking for. Thank you.

I will point a potential driver for next season who is looking for guidance on rollcage/bar specs to this link with the caveat that he should use it for rollcage/bar specs only while Dave Merritt and his team work on the final set of PHA supps. And that he should contact one of our tech inspectors as listed on the contacts page if he wants clarification on anything else.
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Rich Rock »

The 2014 PHA supps can be found at http://www.bmr-SCCA.org/Portals/21/2014 ... _Supps.pdf

I'm sure we'll have them on the PHA site soon.

Thanks to everyone who helped with this project!
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by DaveM »

They can also be found at

http://stcscca.files.wordpress.com/2014 ... y-2014.pdf

on the Steel Cities Region website
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by jerdeitzel »

I guess these Supps are in addition to the actual supps that will post up track info, schedule and officials?
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Rich Rock »

These are the supps for all PHA events. The info you refer to will be on the first page of the entry form for each event, just as it has been for many years, including the events you helped make happen.
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by jerdeitzel »

Thanks, I was just thinking that all that stuff was part of the supps. I'm glad to see you guys were able to work things out and get the issue's resolved that you guys needed. Is there any way to get a copy of what is different between with the supps vs the TTR?
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

DaveM wrote:They can also be found at

http://stcscca.files.wordpress.com/2014 ... y-2014.pdf

on the Steel Cities Region website
Dave -- I just wanted to thank you and the rest of the committee for all your hard work in getting these supps together!

Grace
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gdh57
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

I'm probably late on this :) but I just noticed that the 2014 PHA Supps have been uploaded to the PHA Website under Drivers > Rules (thanks Dale)!

I know this can vary from event to event, but are the non-GCR / non-Solo class rules uploaded anywhere? Or is the plan to still attach this info to each entry since these classes might not be available at every event?
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Matt Rowe »

The typical PHA specific classes (Vintage, INEX, etc..) are referenced in the PHA rulebook with the same language as provided in the supps in previous years. Check pages 37 & 38 from the link on the PHA website. That being said it might be worth providing that portion as a more direct link on the PHA website so that it stands out to new people looking for general class info. Actually it looks like we are missing a good web page for newbies that talks at a high level at the types of classes we have, I thought we used to have something but I could be wrong. I'm suspect that if someone provided our webmaster with some text (maybe even photos) he would be happy to create a page.

I wouldn't want to volunteer anyone but Steve Lewis is well versed in the classes and has a great feel for the questions that new people ask. Maybe some photos from someone like John Pitman to match.
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Mazdahead »

Can someone help me with the problem with the navigation here?
It seems like finding the information should be quite simple, but apparently it is not?
Is it the color, location, what is difficult with the pull down?
Not everything can be on the front page.
Do you want a box with quick document links on the front page?

The supplemental rules are located on the get involved page on the first pull down here:
http://pahillclimb.org/about/get-involved/
They are also on the Classes page in the drivers pull down here:
http://pahillclimb.org/drivers/classes/
Is everyone aware of the little +, may just appear as a triangle in the upper right corner of the PHA website which expands with a click and contains the latest announcements?
If someone would like to review the classes page for accuracy or needed modifications I would be happy to re-post it.
I will read the supps and see if what we have on the page is in order .
Thanks for your suggestions.

Dale
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gdh57
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by gdh57 »

Actually, Dale, I had no problem with the navigation this time. I looked under Drivers > Rules, and found all the documents.

Originally, the problem was that the 2014 supps weren't finalized yet, so of course you couldn't post them. So I was looking for the old (march) 2013 rules on behalf of a new driver who had questions about safety equipment, specifically roll cage construction, and they weren't up on the site yet. You did put them up, and I failed to look again until Dan pointed it out.

This time, when I read the 2014 supps, for some reason I could not find the class info or the additional rules for the non-Solo and non-GCR classes. I suspect this was a reading fail on my part.

In general though, it's sometimes hard to remember whether something is under "About PHA" or "Drivers". However, since I have learned to look in both places, I can generally find what I need based on the sub-menu headings.

Since you asked for my opinion, someone new may have trouble.

I still think Schedule / Results should be its own top level menu. But we've had this discussion before :-)

I'd also reorganize the two menus more along the lines of the following:

Under "About PHA" (I'd also move this last):
Forum
Driver profiles
Uphill Newsletter
PHA Meetings
In the News

Under a new menu that somehow indicates it's about the actual logistics of the event (? Rules and Logistics ??? Something better ?), and would make it first:
Get Involved
Hillclimbing 101
Driver checklist
The courses
Rules
Classes
Permanent numbers
Points

Might even move Get Involved out to it's own top level menu and make it first before the logistics one, and put schedule/results between logistics or whatever better name there is and History.

I like the home page as it is. You could put a schedule/results link on it and ignore my idea of it's own menu (and then put schedule/results under the logistics type one).

Anyway, feel free to ignore my suggestions if they don't make sense. The last thing I want to do to you is what some people did to me when they learned I was looking into the wireless timing system! I had all sorts of suggestions, some were great, some not so great. My very favorite was when Steve Lewis, seeing my exasperation with some of the suggestions (some from complete strangers that happened to be walking by when we were setting up timing), suggested we use tin cans and a rope to relay voice messages down to the start line :lol: The biggest problem with that (aside from the fact it wouldn't actually work) is that we'd be back to running string along the entire length of the course!

I really do like the looks of the new site, but do sometimes have trouble figuring out where to look for information. And some of the people interested in getting into hillclimbing have said the same thing, but once pointed to the location, are happy with the info they find.

Grace
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Re: Where to find the supps for 2014

Post by Mazdahead »

I am going to take these responses and try to eliminate the can't find it syndrome.
These ideas are good and I will try to implement most or as many of them as I can.
Be prepared to find the site a bit different in the upcoming days until I get it right.
I am sure I will break some links and other things until I am done, so hang in there.
Any critisism will be taken as such so please let me know if you have any other ideas now!
I will try and make the site more user friendly and hopefully easier to find things.

Dale
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